[T]he Vatican has confirmed that it’s in negotiations with Saudi Arabia to establish the first Catholic Church inside the Kingdom.Well, zing! As you know, it is presently against Saudi law for any non-Muslim congregation to meet in the kingdom. Even house churches there are illegal, and the penalties can be quite severe. (In fact, mere possession of a Bible is illegal.)
Abe documents how Islamism in in retreat almost everywhere in the Muslim world, being steadily rejected by the ummah every opportunity they get to do so. I remember reading (I think on Michael Yon's site) of an Anbar sheik who said the Sunnis in Iraq had become so lethally oppressed by al Qaeda that even the shephers in the desert hated al Qaeda. "And the shepherds a hundred years from now will still hate al Qaeda."
But back to the church in Saudi Arabia. The Telegraph reports:
Archbishop Mounged El-Hachem, the papal envoy to Kuwait, Qatar, Bahrain, Yemen and the United Arab Emirates said talks had started a few weeks ago, in the wake of King Abdullah’s visit to Pope Benedict last November.The Times OnLine site has this:Currently, all Saudi citizens are required by law to be Muslim, and the Mutaween, or religious police, strictly prohibits the public practice of non-Muslim religions.
The last Christian priest was expelled from the kingdom in 1985.
However, the Vatican’s relationship with the Muslim world is improving rapidly, and Qatar opened its first Catholic church on Sunday.
Mgr El-Hachem said a church in Saudi Arabia would be an important sign of “reciprocity” between the faiths.
Not by chance, the disclosure came just after the first Catholic church in Qatar, Our Lady of the Rosary, was inaugurated at a mass in the seaside capital of Doha attended by 15,000 people and held by Cardinal Ivan Dias, head of the Congregation for Evangelisation, who presented a chalice sent by Pope Benedict XVI. ...Yet, as Abe Greenwald points out, the West is decidedly behind when it comes to whose religion is waxing, and where.This would involve negotiations for the "authorisation of the building of Catholic churches" in Saudi Arabia, he said. Father Federico Lombardi, the Vatican spokesman, said he could not confirm that the two sides were "in negotiations" but added: "If, as we hope, we reach an agreement authorising the construction of the first church in Saudi Arabia, it will be a step of historic importance."
The way was paved not only by King Abdullah's talks with the Pope but also more recently by the setting up of a permanent Catholic-Muslim Forum to repair relations between the two faiths after the Pope's controversial remarks on Islam at Regensburg University in 2006.
The Pope said his apparent reference to Islam as inherently violent and inhumane had been "misunderstood," and he made amends by praying at the Blue Mosque in Istanbul shortly afterwards. He has called however for "reciprocal" gestures by the Muslim side, such as greater tolerance for Christian minorities in Muslim countries.
Vatican Radio said the opening of the church in Qatar was "an event of historical importance after 14 centuries". The church, which bears no crosses or bells, stands on land donated to the Church by Qatar's emir, Sheikh Hamad Bin Khalifa Al-Thani, who favours interreligious dialogue.
The only places we’re faced with renewed Islamic radicalization are in the Muslim enclaves of the West. The Archbishop of Canterbury speaks about the inevitability of sharia in England; France is at a semi-permanent boil of ghettoized Islamic discontent; last month a week of cartoon-inspired riots in Denmark was capped off by a (shockingly unpublicized) bomb in Copenhagen; Canada’s courts are clotted either by alleged terrorists or by “human rights” violators who dare criticize the alleged terrorists; and in Lodi, California more and more Muslim families are home schooling their daughters so that they may “clean and cook for [their] male relatives” and also “to isolate their adolescent and teenage daughters from the corrupting influences that they see in much of American life.” As Qur’anic government has been a demonstrable failure everywhere it’s arisen, the West is becoming one of the last places in which fanatical Muslims are safe enough and comfortable enough to indulge in the decadence of their caliphate fantasies.And then, there's this.
I don't know how much I believe in this new reciprocity. Won't the Saudi churches simply be a way to identify infidels to be used as hostages and apostates available to be put to death by the Mutaween when they regain favor?
In fact, mere possession of any personal items that are cross-shaped is illegal.
Just as 2 decades ago, we would have said:
"As Marxist government has been a demonstrable failure everywhere it's arisen, the West is becoming one of the last places in which fanatical Marxist are safe enough and comfortable enough to indulge in the decadence of their totalitarian fantasies."
Still is. History doesn't exactly repeat itself, but it does sort of rhyme.
Meanwhile, I see this as more of a longer-term approach by Benedict and the Catholic Church than a short-term reaction. The strategy is called "respectful competition."
Religious reciprocity is a very important principle, and the establishment of churches in Muslim lands is just step one.
Step two will be equal treatment of converts, where conversion is accepted as part of religious freedom and honored by both communities. The focus of that effort will not revolve around the Middle East; it will be focused on Europe, and secondarily on Africa.
Benedict's personal attendance at the conversion of one of Italy's most prominent moderate Muslims can be taken as a bellwether in that department.
All these articles ignore the "invisible man" in the Middle East: the millions of foreign guest workers in Saudi and the other Gulf states.
There are probably few Saudi Catholics, but there are a million Catholics in Saudi, and other Orthodox or Protestant Christians.
There are 900 thousand Pinoy OFW in Saudi, probably 80%Christian, and most of the 600thousand Keralan (India) workers are also Catholic. Then there are Lebanese and African Christians.
If Italy can allow their Muslim immigrants to worship, why can't the Saudis do the same? Even the Prophet allowed Christians to worship in lands he conquered.
Reciprocity? As a religious representative, King Abdullah, 'leader' of the Wahhabi death cult is equivalent to Joseph Koby, leader of the Lord's Resistance Army in Uganda. Or an African witch doctor who practices "muti", the ritual murder and mutilation of small children.
Will a church in Saudi Arabia have any effect on the fact that Saudi Arabia, the hub of world terrorism, pays for the murder of children and other innocents every day? I don't think so.
I guess if the Muti pastors or Koby had found themselves sitting on billions of dollars worth of oil, they'd be granting the Pope the honor of their royal presence too. This certainly doesn't say much for our principles.
Wait a second, weren't we told three years ago that the election of this pope meant all kinds of bad things because he was (gasp) a conservative Catholic? I thought he was supposed to be a throwback to an era moderns wished to forget, a hard-liner who was out of touch with the world, a die hard who would never be reasonable, etc.
And now we hear that "the Vatican's relationship with the Muslim world is improving rapidly", and churches are getting opened up in places previously opposed to Catholicism. Whatever happened to the impending doom and gloom and religious schism?
Andrew Sullivan, call your office. The receptionist has a refill on your anti-hysteria meds.
Wahabi Islam is used as a tool to control the people by the various kings and sheiks of the Arab world. While it will take some time, every convert away from Islam weakens its hold over the rest. The Saudi religious police can run rampant only so long as they are not outnumbered, and the political power of Islam only matters so long as it can enforce a brutal conformity. A Catholic Church in the Arab world is a seed that if nurtured would grow to split wide the stone walls of Islam.
While it will take some time, every convert away from Islam weakens its hold over the rest.
Islam is only a recruiting tool - terrorists are also recruited by drugs, money and the pure joy they get from psycopathic destruction. Reforming Islam will have the same effect on terrorism's billion-dollar political and military infrastructure as efforts to reform german culture would have had on the Nazis.
When we treat a death cult leader like King Abdullah with respect, when we treat him like a genuine religious leader, we're empowering the worst elements of the Muslim world.
As thrilling as that news item might seem, there's not going to be any Christian church opening in the KSA anytime soon. The reason isn't just Saudi antipathy, but a broad Muslim understanding that the Prophet Mohammed set aside 'Arabia' as exclusive to Muslims. Indonesians, Turks, Pakistanis all believe this to be the case.
When I first reported on this last month, the first comment I received was from a Pakistani telling me how this just could not happen, that the umma would not permit it. Later reports have thrown cold water on the matter as well.
But Rev. Sensing (and some commenter) are incorrect in stating that Bibles or crosses are illegal. They are not. I've been in the homes of Americans, various Europeans, Indians, Filipinos that had both present. I've been in homes with menorahs and Torahs and attended Christian, Jewish, and Hindu religious services held in private homes, business facilities, embassies and consulates.
The key is the public display of religious symbols other than Islamic and the attempt to hold other-than-Islamic religious services in public. In the past, there have indeed been raids by religious police on what the participants considered private services. The issue was always that large gatherings, in addition to attracting too much attention, crossed some undefined line between public and private. Twenty people in a private home, meeting at the same time each week, is probably going to draw unfavorable attention. A hundred or so at a company auditorium is less likely to do so.
There is certainly no freedom of religion in Saudi Arabia. There are moves, however, to lessen the burden on non-Muslims (or even disfavored Muslims like the Shi'a). But there's still a long way to go and it's not going to happen while we're waiting.
BTW, not only cannot Christians wear crosses in public, but Muslims cannot wear religious symbols either. Saudis consider it to be 'superstitious'.
The people of Switzerland have voted against the building of minarets. Well, you muslims now welcome to our world where we Christians are victimised in your world.